Avengers Vs. X-Men #5 Review
Avengers Vs. X-Men is here. And what better way to handle this than to have our resident Avengers fan (Geoff Arbuckle) and our resident X-Men fan (Victor Kutsenok) come together in a place of neutrality to talk about their favorite teams coming to blows over a cosmic power coming to Earth. Now, Round 5, also known as Avengers Vs X-Men #5 and the final issue of Act I.
Avengers Vs X-Men #5
Victor: Oh my god. I just finished reading issue #5 and I am completely stunned. I can 100% say that I did not see that ending coming. The Avengers are in some deep doo doo right now. Bad enough they picked a fight with the X-Men for no reason. Now they just unleashed holy hell on everyone. However, being the X-fan that I am, I was totally jumping for joy. It’s always nice when the bullies finally get a taste of their own medicine. Even the horrific art by Romita Jr. could not make the little girlish laughter coming out of my mouth go away. So how was this issue for you Geoff?
Geoff: The issue was good, but level with me, Victor, if you were standing there on the moon, and people you know fairly well are standing over you with scary costumes and spooky voices are you honestly saying you’d be rooting for them? I think this whole situation is about a million times worse than how it all started!
The Avengers make their last stand against the Phoenix in Avengers Vs. X-Men #5
Victor: To be honest, if I was an Avenger, I’d be pooping my pants. Not only is the situation much, much worse, but its the Avenger’s fault. I do have a little bit of an advantage over you in the whole “what”s going on” department because I read Uncanny X-Men #13 and I understand why what is happening is actually happening. It seems that the X-Men might have been 100% right in their assumptions of the purpose of the Phoenix force. It was there for rebirth, not destruction. Did you have a chance to read that issue?
Geoff: Not yet. I’m working through my pile as we speak. Without a doubt, I can say that Act I certainly came to a heck of a close. I’m still not too certain if assigning fault is entirely justified. This still isn’t much different than two sides with staunch opinions about what’s going on only escalating the issue with neither side is willing to just stop and take a few minutes to present their ideas without exclamation points. Also, if you step inside the book and view it from the inside out instead of being an omnipotent reader, you’d have to kind of raise an eyebrow at some of the things Scott’s exclaiming. I mean some of what he’s got to say kinda sounds like those people who ambush you at the Wal-Mart and shove pamphlets about being saved and going to a weirdo church and trapping you for twenty minutes when all you want to pick up is a can of Manwich. It borders on scary. If I didn’t have a horse in this race, I’d still think he was acting a bit over the top, thus not helping his side out at all.
Victor: The reason he is saying what he is saying is because…..SPOILER…..he is possessed. By the Phoenix. It should not have happened. It was Tony’s fault as well as the fault of the Unit, an omnipotent computer being held by the X-Men. In any case, I have always been on Scott’s side in this entire affair. Not just because I am an X-Men loyalist, but because I feel he is right. You don’t come to a peace treaty with a nuke strapped to your back. You do not trespass on another man’s property. And most importantly, you do not try to take away their children without any proof of a crime. Cap started this war. If the X-Men had not been distracted by it, they might have had a chance to take care of the danger among them and avoided the current status. In any case, what are your Avengers going to do now? Wanda is their only hope. Maybe Legion can do something as well. If not, why even show a cameo of him. Also, what was up with that K’un Lun dude?
Geoff: In New Avengers, they have connected the K’un Lun and the ancient power of Iron Fist to an obsession the top dude has for the Phoenix Force. Some several hundred years ago, he had visions of a red headed girl getting the power of the Phoenix and he wanted to show her how to fend against it with the Iron Fist.
I’d have to think that they will either need to go to Wanda, or she will get involved independently. Also, I’d like to know what Professor X would think of all this. Any insight on that?
Victor: Xavier was always of the impression of peaceful coexistence between mutant and human. He was however fully aware of what the Phoenix was capable of and even tried to help Jean control it. However, as we all know, nothing can control or contain a force of chaos. Chaos however, does not always mean destruction. It is just a radical change from the current status to a different one. A rebirth of Mutants. One that Hope was supposed to bring about. Xavier would have tried to help Hope control the Phoenix. And he would have probably sided with Cyclops as mutant preservation was also his top priority.
So other than the big reveal. Not too much else has happened. Also, we’re not getting as much action as in the first few issues of the series. I really hope that changes soon. This is the part of the “event” that really makes me hate it. The slow build up to the “sacrifice” issue where someone dies for the “event” to have meaning. Now don’t get me wrong. There was action. However, most of it involved the Phoenix Force decimating everything in its path. I wanted more AvX. Maybe next issue.
Potential major players for Act 2 of Avengers Vs. X-Men?
Geoff: I noticed that as well. I think they realized that even with four different writers, it was going to be relatively impossible to keep up twelve issues of nothing but action. Eventually it would have to take a step back before going at it again. However, I did really like the issue being told from Hope’s POV. It added the one voice we really needed to hear to the series. We know Cyclops’ side. We know Cap’s side. We got a little bit of Hope saying she was ready, but what was really going inside her head? Well, I think this issue answers some of that. She wanted to be ready and she wanted it to be a part of her, but in the end, she was also just as scared as everyone else. It made her more real. She’s not just the girl stuck in the middle.
So, prediction time… Do you think the issue was told from the perspective of what she thought while things were going down or while she was carried off or is she thinking back on what happened at a particularly pivotal point we’ve yet seen? Also, what do you see happening as Act II starts in two weeks?
Victor: I think she was recapping it from a future perspective. Reflecting from a point in the future. Hope still has a major part to play in this. The Phoenix was meant for her. Unfortunately, it has taken a detour at the moment.
As for Act II, the first thing I see happening is an artist with some ability to draw individual and unique characters finally being allowed to do this “event” some justice. (Bye Romita, you will not be missed) I see an overpowered group of X-Men decimating anyone and anything that tries to stop them from doing what needs to be done. I see the Earth’s Mightiest Heroes being in for a world of hurt. The Avengers are in trouble. Period. They started a war. Now they are outgunned and overpowered and they don’t really do the whole run and hide thing so I see some bad days ahead for the Avengers. Some awesomely heroic last stands, but last stands nonetheless. I also see Wanda entering the picture. How and to what end I am unsure.
What do you see happening in Act II?
Geoff: Yeah. I agree with you. The whole promotional scheme around this is “No More Avengers” – a play on the no more mutants thing from House of M. I will assume the Avengers will face utter decimation. That’s where I see Wanda stepping in. Heck, perhaps both Wanda and Hope will team up and try to find an even ground so everyone can come out of this with as little loss as possible. I’m also sure the Vision will get shredded. The poor bastard always gets torn apart in big stories.
Some of that art Geoff and Victor enjoyed soooo much.
I certainly hope this is the end of JRJR. After a “not bad” #4, this one was bad. The money shot could have been so much better. It probably is the worst of the five issues so far. I keep saying goodbye to him and he keeps coming back. It’s starting to get a tad frustrating, but I’m positive this has to be the end. Bring on Olivier Coipel for some really awesome art!
Let’s talk about scores. I’m going to give this a 90. The story is there, the progression is there and there was certainly a nicely kept secret waiting at the end of the book for everyone. It feels like a true event. I’m not expecting Shakespeare, just some big action-y story that I can really get excited about reading every other week. However, I have to take some points off for JRJR. The whole thing just fell apart in the art.
Victor: I’m going to agree with you on 90. The big reveal at the end really sealed it for me especially since Uncanny X-Men #13 explains why it is so relevant. JRJR is always a low point for me but I accept the pain. I pray this is the last we see of him too. Also, finally having the Phoenix arrive and cut loose was pretty cool so I definitely enjoyed that. I hope we get some one on ones next issue. I’ll keep my fingers crossed.
Geoff: Well, the good news is that we do have some one on ones coming in the form of Vs. next week. Looks like some of it might be from the very battle on the Moon we saw in this issue. I’m thinking we’re going to see some decidedly X-Men victories, but we’ll see! Until then, my X-buddy!
A COMIC BOOK BLOG RATING
| Pros | Cons |
|---|---|
| The story works, the action is there as well as the progression. Great end to the first act. | Art. Really bad this time around. |
| Rating |
9 Comments
As much of an X-Men fan that I am, I hated this issue. Dividing the Phoenix between five random mutants with serious ethical problems? Really? That was too cliché, but even worse, it was ridiculous. I agree with Geoff, they sounded like those unbearable religious fanatics, I just can’t root for the X-Men at this point.
But there is something interesting to it: why Cyclops, Frost, Namor and the Rasputins? Cyclops is obvious, but if they wanted old villains to have that power, why not put Magneto with the group that went to the moon as well? Whatever is the reason, I’m sure it has something to do with Wanda’s significance from now on.
I was a little upset that Cyclops still had his visor. I would think that the Phoenix Force would be powerful enough for him not to wear one. Plus, it would really convey how powerful he is now.
I agree with the comment Ellie made. It’s hard for me to root for the X-Men at this point. The Avengers may have caused the mess, but it’s not like the X-Men weren’t partially to blame either. Cyclops and the X-Men are going around bitching about their “Messiah” putting their religious rights over the possible saftey of others. And the Avengers went about handling it like President Bush went about handling the Weapons of Mass Destruction that Iraq completely (didn’t) have. It was excessive, they went based on Bad intel and now have a mess on their hands that will take them years to clean up. The X-Men seem like religious extremists, and the Avengers look like a team who took things too far with bad data. I can’t find myself rooting for anyone in the series so far. It’s a chore for me to read at this point. Some of the Characters decisions aren’t in their character and it drives me a little batty. I dunno, I am a massive X-Men and Avengers fan (Marvel fan in General) but I think this arc is pretty weak.
Guys,
I just don’t understand why Marvel couldn’t recruit one of their top artists for this series. It’s embarrassing.
Hi Victor,
As an X-Fan, you come to the table with more knowledge than I, and it’s certainly not your fault that Marvel can’t give me all the pieces I need to connect the dots over 5 issues – so, I have some questions relating to your statements:
“Bad enough they picked a fight with the X-Men for no reason. Now they just unleashed holy hell on everyone. ”
Didn’t the Avengers ‘pick a fight with the X-Men’ because every time the phoenix comes to earth, it tears the joint up? I can see why they’d want to prevent that. since that what always happens.
“Not only is the situation much, much worse, but its the Avenger’s fault.”
How is this the Avengers fault?
“It was there for rebirth, not destruction. ”
Based on what? the phoenix has always been a destructive force in the past…
“However, as we all know, nothing can control or contain a force of chaos. Chaos however, does not always mean destruction. It is just a radical change from the current status to a different one. A rebirth of Mutants. One that Hope was supposed to bring about. ”
I tend to agree with your assessment of what Scott has been saying here – but it makes Scott sound like a religious cook, as Geoff pointed out. Since he spent so much time living at a school, I thought he’d be more interested in logic… I also don’t understand why of all the X-Men, only Wolverine seems to remember how crazy and destructive the phoenix was – everyone else just blindly follows Scott, despite the fact that he’s been acting like a crazy person and saying crazy things for a long while now.
Help me out, Victor – how are the X-Men and Scott the PROTAGONISTS in this story? It looks like they’ve been possessed by The Phoenix, just kicked the Avengers collective butts and are on their way to earth to kick more butt. like the phoenix always does when it goes to earth. what’s happening here (in other titles?) that tells us that the phoenix has a different agenda this time?
Hi Jamie,
Before I respond to your comment, let me address all the other ones. Go read Uncanny X-Men #13. It explains the whole reason why the X-Men were possessed, and why it was five of them. Also, you need to know that when Hope was born, 5 other new mutants (the 5 Lights that the Generation Hope series was about) were born as well. This possession is fully explained in that book. I will try to review it today but can’t make any promises.
OK. Back to your questions.
Romita was the Avengers regular artist so he got the call. I hate that decision more than anyone but apparently he is considered a good artist in the comic world so go figure. Starting next issue, hopefully, a real talented artist will jump on board and the memory of Romita will fade into obscurity. (Which is where he belongs)
The Phoenix has never really come to earth. People need to stop saying that destruction always happens when it appears. Jean Grey brought it to earth when the Phoenix answered her call for help a loooooong time ago. It is a force of cosmic balance. If the earth needs to be razed to adjust that balance, the Phoenix will do the razing. Much like Galactus will eat planets to survive, the Phoenix will do the same. The Phoenix, to my knowledge, has never done anything to the earth at all. It has decimated other planets, but never earth. The Avengers just assumed that the purpose of the Phoenix coming to earth was to destroy it and acted upon that assumption. That’s what makes this the Avengers fault. If they wanted to go after the Phoenix, fine. Enjoy the beating you get. If they had left the X-Men alone, then maybe they could have discovered the Unit’s treachery (see Uncanny #13), not have been on the moon, and avoided being possessed.
The rebirth, not destruction answer is in Uncanny #13. To sum up, the Scarlet Witch caused a cosmic imbalance with her “No More Mutants” The phoenix will fix it be reigniting the mutant spark.
Scott may be a religious nut, but it’s all he has. It’s his last lifeline to the survival of his entire race. The Phoenix can be destructive. But it can also save. It saved the entire universe when it used it’s power to heal the M’Kraan crystal. But no one seems to remember that. For some reason all they can remember is how it destroys. The problem is that no one can prove it. During the Dark Phoenix Saga, we got a history lesson of the Phoenix and watched it destroy a planet, but it has never done anything destructive since then.
Can the Phoenix blow up the world? Hell yes. It can burn away reality in a heartbeat and NOTHING can stop it. It is stupid to try. That’s the full extent of it’s powers. However, since this is a comic, the Avengers MUST try. Scott can be painted as much of a villain as possible, he still has more knowledge of the Phoenix than anyone other than his daughter Rachel and his dead wife Jean. He just knows what it can do. That’s why he believes. The Avengers acted upon assumption and fear. Scott acted upon knowledge and faith. Everyone follows Scott because he is their leader. Just like everyone followed Cap to Utopia and gang rushed the X-Men without ever questioning him.
Whatever the Phoenix plans to do, nothing will stop it. The next few issues will showcase that point. However, as I said before, the Avengers would not be the Avengers if they don’t try.
I hope I answered some of the questions and issues. Keep commenting with more and I will happily respond.
The Phoenix force destroyed again in the Morrison run, it also nearly went insane and destroyed Earth when it possessed Quentin during the “Phoenix Warsong” series. Now I know much of the Grant Morrison stuff isn’t considered canon because it was “re-wiped” the issue after Morrison left his run, but still the point is, OH yeah, the Phoenix Force has destroyed since the DPS back nearly 30 years ago.
I’m not disagreeing with you, I’ve never felt the Pheonix Force is a destructive influence, but a balance. It’s like the seasons, Winter always leads to Spring.
Just thought I’d throw in a 2cents. This is my first time on the blog and I’m enjoying the commentary and articles!
Did anyone else notice that cyclops’s phoenix suit looked almost identical to nightwing’s?
Hi Victor,
See, this is the problem with events – I DON’T WANT TO READ Uncanny X-Men #13 and I don’t think I should have to. This is issue 5 of the event and it looks like there are at least 3 or so to go, so I don’t see why Marvel can’t give me all of the pieces I need right here. I get that the purpose of events is to sell more books, but jeez! Is buying every book they put out the only way to keep Marvel happy?
Romita is TERRIBLE. I don’t get it. I know you don’t, either, but he’s so terrible, it’s worth repeating.
OK, so it would be more proper to say that ‘every time the phoenix ENDS UP on earth, it kicks everyone’s butt.’ I get that now. and now i see the problem:
“It saved the entire universe when it used it’s power to heal the M’Kraan crystal. But no one seems to remember that. For some reason all they can remember is how it destroys”
See, I’m pretty sure that’s Marvel’s fault, because I know about the Dark Phoenix saga even though I didn’t read it. I’ve honestly never heard of that crystal-thingy until you just told me about it.
“The Avengers acted upon assumption and fear. Scott acted upon knowledge and faith.”
the difference between ‘assumption’ and ‘faith’ is kinda just point of view (Obi-Wan Kenobi style), isn’t it?
“Everyone follows Scott because he is their leader. Just like everyone followed Cap to Utopia and gang rushed the X-Men without ever questioning him. ”
I remember Cap going down there to talk to Scott and when the conversation went south, Scott zapped Cap. I don’t remember Cap making the first move toward violence, and as that’s not his character, it wouldn’t make sense if he had. Cap is the great debtor – he’d argue with Scott for a week before he tried punching him in the face. Also, Cap, Iron Man and the US government all seemed to be on the same page BEFORE the Avengers went to Utopia, so I don’t think the team was blindly following cap.
talking with you is more fun than this even! i’ll try to read the new one tonight and catch you on that page…
Technically, Jamie, you really don’t need to read the tie-ins. This event has moved from one issue to the next fairly well. Plus, this is a 12 part story, so there’s still plenty to go. If you want to know what’s going on with this person or that person, you can. Issue #5 spells it out pretty well that Iron Man and the Avengers tried to blow up the Phoenix but failed and now five splintered fragments of the Phoenix took up hosts. That’s about it.